A Failed Board of Review

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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:17 am

What she thinks is not important. ALl that counts is National Policy and She is way over the line with that.
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Postby lifescoutforlife » Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:26 am

The more I read on this post the more it blows my mind and makes me mad. I don't know how but somewhere down the road they need to make training required. I have learned so much from training over the last couple years it's unbelievable. Some of the rules I learn about may not be what I believe in but they are the rules reguardless what I or anyone else believes in they must be followed and not modified to someone beliefs.
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Re: failed board of review

Postby Mrw » Thu Feb 21, 2008 11:53 am

jreader4564 wrote:
The CC said she brought in an outsider because she didn't think she would have enough board memebers there for the review.


Then it would be more fair to the boy to postpone the BOR until she could assure that there would be enough adults there to do it. This should not be all that hard to do.

I would still bring the bad advice and inappropriate actions of the District person to Council's attention. These are the people that cause boys to quit by putting extra roadblocks in their way.
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Postby Fibonacci » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:29 pm

The Board of Review was not composd of 3-6 Committee members of the Troop so anything they decided can't be appealed, it's as if it didn't happen. The youth can have a Board of review as soon as you get 3 committee members together.

Agreed!

Who schedules the Boards of Review in your troop? As Advancement Chair, I am the only one who schedules them. Scouts ask me, not the Committee Chair. Rather than have Boards every month, we have them when they are needed for specific Scouts who are ready. So Jerry has asked for a Board, I contact the trained Committee Members, and set it up for the 20 minutes before the next meeting. Our CC deals with administrative issues ~ the overall health & function of the troop.
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:38 pm

This was a shaft job plain and simple! :!:
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Postby ThunderingWind » Thu Feb 21, 2008 1:18 pm

lifescoutforlife wrote:... I don't know how but somewhere down the road they need to make training required.


Agreed!! And there needs to be a certification test as well. Simple, multiple guess will suffice, 50 questions. Some general Scouting and YP but mainly position specific.
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Postby WeeWillie » Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:01 pm

I have been a trainer for NLE, SM/ASM and Outdoor Skills. I can tell who is interested and who is blowing me off. Within Scouting there are adults who are going to do things their way regardless.
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:07 pm

How many think these types should be gotten rid of??
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Postby ThunderingWind » Thu Feb 21, 2008 4:45 pm

wagionvigil wrote:How many think these types should be gotten rid of??


If they will not comply with the standards, I say they should not be involved.

I know that there are rules I do not agree with but I work with them. I still ask why the rule is in place and how to recommend a change. And I always look at the rules for a way to allow something to happen, not stop something (unless it is an absolute no-no or those dark grey area issues).
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Re: failed board of review

Postby Hubert » Thu Feb 21, 2008 7:28 pm

jreader4564 wrote:...

The CC said she brought in an outsider because she didn't think she would have enough board memebers there for the review.


I would suggest then another scouter he may know. Someone from a different troop maybe, not a total stranger.
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Postby Fibonacci » Thu Feb 21, 2008 7:56 pm

Justin ~ the main "error" experienced by this Scout is that a Board for Tenderfoot thru Life is composed of members of his Troop Committee. Outsiders are welcomed on an Eagle Board, but may not serve on other Boards.
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Postby Hubert » Thu Feb 21, 2008 10:22 pm

Fibonacci wrote:Justin ~ the main "error" experienced by this Scout is that a Board for Tenderfoot thru Life is composed of members of his Troop Committee. Outsiders are welcomed on an Eagle Board, but may not serve on other Boards.


In almost every case, the board of review is conducted by at least three members of the troop committee.


This is off the site Wagion posted on page 2.

As long as that is covered, I see no harm. However, I am NOT in favor of a stranger being on a lower rank board.

I know. However, I had a smililar problem. I had many of my BoR at weekend summer camps and troop commettie was not there. I wanted a BoR really badly, so they were not going to deny me this right. So, we got people that knew me and have watched me grow. They are registered scouts, but from another troop. I did not wish to wait, I was ready then. So, instead of making me wait, we made a board of one troop CM and others who knew me.

If you have the resources available on hand, why make him wait?

I just think its better having someone he knows than a total stranger.
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Postby ASM-142 » Fri Feb 22, 2008 9:10 am

Hubert wrote:As long as that is covered, I see no harm. However, I am NOT in favor of a stranger being on a lower rank board.

The harm is that if a BOR is held with non troop committee members then this is not a valid BOR.

Hubert wrote:I know. However, I had a smililar problem. I had many of my BoR at weekend summer camps and troop commettie was not there. I wanted a BoR really badly, so they were not going to deny me this right. So, we got people that knew me and have watched me grow. They are registered scouts, but from another troop. I did not wish to wait, I was ready then. So, instead of making me wait, we made a board of one troop CM and others who knew me.

Holding a BOR without troop committee members just because the scout is at summer camp and really wants to have his BOR is no reason to have a BOR. If challenged then each of your BORs that were held without the troop committee proesent could result in your advancement being revoked

Hubert wrote:If you have the resources available on hand, why make him wait?

You make the scout wait until the troop committee is available. Anything else is not following scouting policies that require that the troop committee conduct the BOR

Hubert wrote:I just think its better having someone he knows than a total stranger.

A BOR is not just about the scout but how the troop is running. If a troop committee member is a stranger to the scout it is up to that person to make the scout feel comfortable. Comfort or not, if this person is on the troop committee then they have the right and obligation to sit on a BOR.
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Postby evmori » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:24 am

wagionvigil wrote:How many think these types should be gotten rid of??


Yes they should go! And go far away!
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Postby Chief J » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:46 am

wagionvigil wrote:How many think these types should be gotten rid of??


Yes, Scouting will not miss them, and the program will be a better program without them.

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Postby OldGreyBear » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:16 pm

Hubert, in this case, what you are saying is your desire to have a Board of Review made it ok for the Troop to ignore a BSA policy because you wanted it to.

How does it make you feel when you see other people flout the rules and get away with it? If your school has a rule against having cell phones turned on during class and you see a student talking on the phone and 3 teachers walk by, does it irritate you because you strive to follow the rules?
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Postby Fibonacci » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:35 pm

ASM-142 wrote
If challenged then each of your BORs that were held without the troop committee present could result in your advancement being revoked.

As soon as our troop learned the correct policy for members of a Board of Review, we began allowing only registered Committee Members. However, for many years the troop had been allowing any adult to participate. The District Advancement chair told us that the previous Boards held without Troop Committee members would not be revoked (sigh of relief was heard from many Life Scouts & their parents!) Of course this info was from a District volunteer, and we know that they are just people and can make mistakes. (Isn't that what the original post is about?)
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:41 pm

You will find they are not just making a mistake. They are doing it their way and the Heck with the correctc way.
Last edited by wagionvigil on Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby smtroop168 » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:22 pm

It is HIGHLY unlikely that an advancement would be revoked unless some sort of fraud is involved. National's position is that a "card laid is a card played" and will never penalize the scout for the boneheaded actions of an adult. This is also true of MBs being signed by "unapproved counselors".
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:28 pm

You are correct they would never hurt the scout. But on the other hand BSA is very lax in punishing adult leaders that constantly do it their Way.
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