Get'r done before 18

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Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Fri Oct 29, 2010 2:06 pm

Split off:

smtroop168 wrote:
What do you all think about changing the rule that EVERYTHING including the BOR has to be done prior to their 18th birthday?
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby WVBeaver05 » Fri Oct 29, 2010 7:37 pm

Don't think it would make any difference. It would just set the deadline slightly earlier and most if not all would work to that date. Not to say that it is a bad idea, just that I don't see any significant difference either way.

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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:37 pm

Mt Brother in Law's council sees almost 70% wanting extensions for EBORs. How about if there were no waivers except for scouts with disabilities?
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby WVBeaver05 » Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:59 pm

smtroop168 wrote:Mt Brother in Law's council sees almost 70% wanting extensions for EBORs...

That is a ridiculous number. How many are granted?

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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:46 am

WVBeaver05 wrote:
smtroop168 wrote:Mt Brother in Law's council sees almost 70% wanting extensions for EBORs...

That is a ridiculous number. How many are granted?

YiS


Sorry...Not worded well...70% of their EBORs are held in the 0-3 months grace period after they turn 18.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby Billiken » Sat Oct 30, 2010 7:46 am

The scheduling of the EBOR is basically out of the control of the Scout.
Put another way, an Eagle Candidate is "at the mercy" of the schedules of the adults needed to staff the EBOR.

The current procedures should remain in place.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby WVBeaver05 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:59 am

smtroop168 wrote:
WVBeaver05 wrote:
smtroop168 wrote:Mt Brother in Law's council sees almost 70% wanting extensions for EBORs...

That is a ridiculous number. How many are granted?

YiS


Sorry...Not worded well...70% of their EBORs are held in the 0-3 months grace period after they turn 18.

Ok. That's quite a bit different. I would say the ones that I know about approach 50%. I don't see a problem with that. As Billiken pointed out, the Scout can request the EBOR, but he doesn't schedule it. And, we have seen here how some adults can throw up roadblocks for Scouts.

As I have watched numerous Scouts (my son most closely and most recently) I am concluding that with many of them it is not procrastination so much as prioritization of activities. Like, "...I know I have until November to get this complete so I am going to devote my time now to xxxx knowing that I'll get it done..." They are young, and haven't had the experiences that some of us "older" folks have had. The way my son managed his time IS NOT how I would have (now!) done it - but I did the same thing in my youth. Now, as he "grows up" will he regret not managing it a bit differently and taking advantage of getting a couple Eagle palms? Probably, I do. But, maybe that lesson is why I would have done it differently :-)

So, I stick with my position of leaving it the way it is. I don't even consider it to be a grace period, just part of the process.

But, I do think it is a good question and a good thing to discuss.

YiS
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Sat Oct 30, 2010 11:03 am

Billiken wrote:The scheduling of the EBOR is basically out of the control of the Scout.
Put another way, an Eagle Candidate is "at the mercy" of the schedules of the adults needed to staff the EBOR.

The current procedures should remain in place.



Right the scout doesn't schedule the BOR. As a member of our DAC, we could put together an Eagle board in less than a week. I would also say a number of adults are placed at the mercy of the Eagle Candidate when they want them to jump through hoops for the EP approval process, scheduling their EPs, getting their Eagle App completed etc.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby jr56 » Mon Nov 01, 2010 2:31 pm

Just to give the EBOR members the benefit of the doubt. The current system allows for them to arrange their schedules to accomodate the Eagle candidate.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby FrankJ » Mon Nov 01, 2010 3:52 pm

The current method is simple & has a clear cut off. Really do not see a good reason to change it.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby Bill Pitcher » Mon Nov 01, 2010 10:28 pm

Most Scouts in our council have everything turned in by the 18th. B'Day . . . including the application w/signatures, the final report, etc. Rare is the boy who doesn't. But, just in case, there is leeway built in. The EBoR? I like it the way it is, with a 3 month grace period. we who hold the EBoR aren't always available, especially in the next two months with all of the Holidays, travel to families, etc. So, I think that the process works. No need for a change, Matt!
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Nov 02, 2010 12:53 pm

People will always expand or contract their time to meet whatever deadline is provided. When scouts don't even have their EBORs until they have aged out of the program, there is no opportunity for them to show off their accomplishment within their troop, the medal stays in the box and goes in a drawer.

This does cut down on the number of scouts that can earn Eagle Palms so it a cost savings for the BSA as they don't have to make as many pins/cards.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby Bill Pitcher » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:53 pm

This is true, but as the old saying goes: "You can only lead the horse to the water, . . ." They all seem to push the deadline!
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby VenturingL » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:59 pm

My son had his Scout Master conference the night before he turned 18 - troop had unofficial "time served in POR" rules & cost him about 7 months over a 2 year period. Scout Master traveled a lot & SMC was postponed at least once. His EBoR was postponed because Eagle Coordinator had not received all the letters of reference (I know - that one has been covered in other threads). Coordinator was busy with other scouts who were pushing their 18th b-days & so the EBoR was not rescheduled until day 88 of the 90 day grace period. Sometimes the scout does not bear the sole responsibility for getting Eagle at 18.

Son is still active - has 1 more year in Venturing & proudly has the Eagle rank patch on his uniform. Our Charter Org has recently taken on a very young (11-13 yr. olds) boy scout troop & he is working with them.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:23 pm

Generally what we see is that the EP is the item that is completed a week or less before 18. the POR is the least of our worried since most of these scouts have been Life scouts for alot longer than 6 months. Obviously you can't hold the SMC until all requirements are completed (although I'm sure some have).

VenturingL wrote:Sometimes the scout does not bear the sole responsibility for getting Eagle at 18.
Not sure I agree with that statement.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby jr56 » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:31 pm

Actually, with all the artificial roadblocks being thrown up by leaders, I tend to agree with it.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:47 pm

jr56 wrote:Actually, with all the artificial roadblocks being thrown up by leaders, I tend to agree with it.


Maybe it's pie in the sky but I believe the scout is responsible for meeting the requirements of attaining Eagle rank. Completing MBs, POR, EP, Eagle Application are his job. How he exercises that responsibility is certainly open for debate. Getting assistance from whatever sources he needs to accomplish his responsibilities is his task. A little research in breaking down the roadblocks is all contained in a few BSA publications.

As it appears a large number of scouts have their EBORs after they are 18, these young men need to be ready to meet their responsibilities head on and this process is a good way for them to learn. A deer in the headlights look on a 17.5 y/o is not what we would hope to see at this point but if they've never had to do it themselves, that's what you get.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby FrankJ » Tue Nov 02, 2010 8:31 pm

Now that I think about it, the allowance to have the EBOR after the 18th birthday is for the benefit of the adults doing the eagle boards. Can you the imagine the pressure to have EBOR on the 18th day? And don't say it would not happen. A great number of appeals would also have to be processed as well. I wonder if it is the reason for the current system? Or just uncommon fore site of the rule makers?
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby evmori » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:43 am

Billiken wrote:The scheduling of the EBOR is basically out of the control of the Scout.
Put another way, an Eagle Candidate is "at the mercy" of the schedules of the adults needed to staff the EBOR.

The current procedures should remain in place.


Huh? If a Scout waits until the last minute to finish, how is that out of his control? I totally disagree with Billiken's statement.
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Re: Get'r done before 18

Postby jr56 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:20 am

True Ed. But how much time should a scout allow for the EBOR to be convened if the current system were changed. 1 month, 3 months, 9 months? I would say the vast majority of Eagle board members do the best they can to have the BOR done in a timely fashion. But sometimes members are out of town for one reason or another, maybe an illness, there are all sorts of things that could delay an EBOR.
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