Boundary question for two deep leadership

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Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby Fred Johnson » Wed Jan 19, 2011 2:41 pm

Four scouts from our troop want to go to a council run program offered at a council run camp. Since four is too small for the program, they will be paired with scouts from another troop.

The issue is that we can only find one adult willing to go. The program involves sleeping outside at probably -10, -15 or -20 degrees.

Once they are there, they will have their council employed guide, the adults from the other troop(s) and the one adult from our troop.

#1 Is that enough to cover the youth protection requirements?

#2 Is the drive okay? Often we have one adult and multiple scouts in the car. I don't really see this as any different. This would be one registered leader and four scouts.

I think it is okay, but it seems open to interpretation.

Any guidance would be great.
Fred Johnson
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby FrankJ » Wed Jan 19, 2011 4:02 pm

You can look at this from several different perspectives. I always take the one that works best for me. The event really does not start until you get to camp so two deep leadership is not an issue. Registered leaders should avoid one on one contact in scouting situations. Having more than one scout in the car satisfies that requirement. I do not see an issue.
Frank J.
Venturing Crew Adviser, Assistant Scout Master, Renegade Merit Badge Counselor
Owl-2 WB 92-49
Foothills District Atlanta Area Council
I never teach my pupils. I only attempt to provide the conditions in which they can learn.--Albert Einstein
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby smtroop168 » Wed Jan 19, 2011 4:50 pm

Or call it a Patrol activity where currently no adults are required.
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby lambeausam » Thu Jan 20, 2011 9:02 am

We had a similar situation at summer camp a few years ago. We were a small troop of 5 boys plus two leaders. A few weeks before camp, the director contacted me regarding a troop that had three boys and one adult that wanted to attend camp. We combined and it worked out beautifully. Same rationale as a previous post - no one was solo with a scout during the trip to the campground and the combined adult leadership covered the scout:adult ratio required.
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby jr56 » Thu Jan 20, 2011 12:41 pm

Yes, I have encountered similar situations myself. You are good to go.
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby Fibonacci » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:27 pm

We had a similar situation a few years ago. The problem was that we couldn't get a tour permit with only one adult. I talked with our council staff person in charge of Tour Permits, and he confirmed what I thought; a Tour Permit could not be completed with only one adult from our troop. Then he said that he hoped the 3 boys & 1 adult had a great time on their rafting trip. (They did!)
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Re: Boundary question for two deep leadership

Postby WeeWillie » Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:27 am

Get your council's policy.

The requirement is for two registerred adults or one registered adult and a parent. One registerred adult must have YPT. Nowhere does it say that both adults must be from the same troop so.......

1 Registerred Adult from Troop 1 with YPT
1 Registerred Adult from Troop 2 with YPT

Both troops provide their own leader with YPT and the second adult is coverred by the other troop.

We once had a new troop use a commissioner as the second leader. 1st meeting Monday, 1st Camporee Friday. Ir you aint outing you aint Scouting.
Mike Wilson
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