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Answers, ideas, and suggestions on the stuff troops need.

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Postby PaulSWolf » Fri May 20, 2005 5:20 pm

And Sports uniforms are, for the most part supplied by the team, not purchased by the participant.
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Postby ICanCanoeCanU » Fri May 20, 2005 5:49 pm

So why does anyone bother to wear a uniform? And if someone new checks into the troop and ask's what item they should bye are we to suggest the usual camping items but no uniform is needed?

Maybe this is adding to and not a requirement by BSA but our troop is sticking to policy which has been voted on by the SPL/leaders and committee members.

For troops to allow scouts to request promotion without being in uniform, I can only imagine how that troop looks during meetings?

EDIT - btw - I know it doesn't state this in any policy and can not show you where it says this, so don't ask me to prove it, please.
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Postby hacimsaalk » Fri May 20, 2005 6:54 pm

Lynda J wrote:A scout must be in as much of his uniform as he owns to attend a BOR.
We do have a couple of boys that simply can not afford the pants. But they must be in jeans that are clean and not torn. And the remainder of the uniform must be there.

It is a real problem with the cost of the pants. With a kid that grows so fast. Kevin is one of the smallest boys in our troop. He has outgrown pair of pants and a pair of shorts so far this year. I keep watch at all the resale shops for uniforms.


this is the same with our troop. we changed that after one of the boys quit, after being told he wasnt in the proper uniform because he didnt wear "scout pants", because his family couldnt afford them.

they do get expensvie. the age group of boys that is in scouts, is the age group that grows, and fills out the most.

the only thing we require for board of rewiews is a scout shirt, bolo, and merit badge sash (if 1st class or above)
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Postby ICanCanoeCanU » Sat May 21, 2005 1:16 am

Yes, good clarification on what a uniform consists of - our troop requires scout shirt (neatly tucked in) and kneckerchief for BOR and sash for COH and any other formal event. Regular meetings is uniform shirt and kneckerchief.
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Postby ASM-142 » Mon May 23, 2005 7:47 am

As much as we as leaders do not like this - we can not even require scouts to wear their shirts to a BOR.
If it is not written down then it is not an official rule
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Postby evmori » Mon May 23, 2005 8:59 am

ICanCanoeCanU wrote:So why does anyone bother to wear a uniform? And if someone new checks into the troop and ask's what item they should bye are we to suggest the usual camping items but no uniform is needed?

Maybe this is adding to and not a requirement by BSA but our troop is sticking to policy which has been voted on by the SPL/leaders and committee members.

For troops to allow scouts to request promotion without being in uniform, I can only imagine how that troop looks during meetings?

EDIT - btw - I know it doesn't state this in any policy and can not show you where it says this, so don't ask me to prove it, please.


The only problem is if a Scout is denied a BOR because of the lack of a uniform & he decides to appeal to a higher authority. You should be overruled.

In our Troop, we encourage all Scouts & Scouter's to be in full uniform and have very good results. Most Scouts don't own Scout pants but all wear their uniform shirts correctly adorned. I think all the adult leaders own complete uniforms & wear them most of the time.
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Postby ASM-142 » Mon May 23, 2005 9:21 am

The way things are wording from national we can only limit ourselves to "encourage" and not "require" uniforms for meetings, BORs, etc.
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Postby hops_scout » Mon May 23, 2005 12:08 pm

When you get to thinking about it, you could "require" some uniform piece, etc

There's a requirement for every rank: "Show Scout spirit"

I would consider not wearing ANY uniform piece to be not "showing Scout spirit" unless of course they can not afford the uniform.
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Postby diamondbackAPL » Mon May 23, 2005 12:10 pm

I need to ask about this. I just looked up our troop uniform rules, and it said nothing about what to wear to a board of review.
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Postby evmori » Mon May 23, 2005 12:15 pm

hops_scout wrote:When you get to thinking about it, you could "require" some uniform piece, etc

There's a requirement for every rank: "Show Scout spirit"

I would consider not wearing ANY uniform piece to be not "showing Scout spirit" unless of course they can not afford the uniform.


Yeah you could but that's bit of a stretch, hops. Remember, its "Show Scout Spirit in you everyday life" & Scouting is only one part of everyday life.
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Postby ASM-142 » Mon May 23, 2005 2:39 pm

What would you do if the scout asks he needs to do to show "scout spirit" after you turn him down? If you tell him to wear a uniform then you are adding to the requirements. If you tell him anything else you are not being truthful.
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Postby Buffalo Bill » Mon May 23, 2005 3:51 pm

Uniform & Scout Spirit--from BSA fact sheet at http://www.scouting.org/factsheets/02-503.html :

(Emphasis mine)

The methods by which the aims are achieved are listed below in random order to emphasize the equal importance of each.

Uniform
The uniform makes the Boy Scout troop visible as a force for good and creates a positive youth image in the community. Boy Scouting is an action program, and wearing the uniform is an action that shows each Boy Scout's commitment to the aims and purposes of Scouting. The uniform gives the Boy Scout identity in a world brotherhood of youth who believe in the same ideals. The uniform is practical attire for Boy Scout activities and provides a way for Boy Scouts to wear the badges that show what they have accomplished.

LOYAL
A Scout is true to his family, Scout leaders, friends, school, and nation.

OBEDIENT
A Scout follows the rules of his family, school, and troop. He obeys the laws of his community and country. If he thinks these rules and laws are unfair, he tries to have them changed in an orderly manner rather than disobey them.

CLEAN
A Scout keeps his body and mind fit and clean. He goes around with those who believe in living by these same ideals. He helps keep his home and community clean.


How to apply the wearing of the uniform to Scout Spirit and the Scout Law? If each of the methods is of equal importance, why would someone be more willing to give up uniforming vice any of the other methods? If a boy is UNWILLING to wear a Scout uniform, he does not show "commitment to the aims and purposes of Scouting", nor does he identify with "a world brotherhood of youth who believe in the same ideals." Sounds like spirit to me.

Doesn't say anywhere that my unit can't use the uniform method as much as we use the other seven methods of equal importance.
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Postby Buffalo Bill » Mon May 23, 2005 4:04 pm

One more reason I feel comfortable requiring the Scout uniform for certain Scout Functions.

From the Boy Scout and Varsity Scout Application for the National Jamboree Participant Statement of Understanding and Code of Conduct:

(emphasis mine)

"All youth and adult participants are expected to abide by the Code of Conduct as follows:...

3. I will set a good example by keeping myself neatly dressed and presentable. (The official Scout uniform and jamboree identifying items
are the only acceptable apparel.)
"

Haven't heard of a Scout going to Jamboree without a uniform yet.
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Postby cballman » Mon May 23, 2005 4:57 pm

well then that poses another great question. If scouting DOES NOT require uniforms then why at a national jambo then you must be in uniform? I would think that if a uniform is required for jambo then it must be required in troops? hey IMHO they both qualify as scout functions and if a uniform is not required for a scout troop then how can you stop a kid or adult from going to jambo without one? just a few more questions to think about why we should have a UNIFORM.
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Postby wagionvigil » Mon May 23, 2005 5:12 pm

Charlie That is simple; Everyone does not attend a Jamboree and those going know in advance that a uniform is required to attend!
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Postby commish3 » Mon May 23, 2005 6:36 pm

If you read the Scout Handbook you will see that the the scout uniform has nothing to do with scout spirit. If a bor refuses an advancement based on scout spirit, or any other requirement, they must specify how a scout can meet the requirement(s).

Since the Scout Spirit requirement is about living the Oath and Law in your everday life (it does not say only in your scout life) Then that is what the clarification should refer to...the points of the Scout Law and the three obligations of the Scout Oath. The uniform is a method of scouting, a guide for adult leaders, not a value of scouting.

The uniform is an outward symbol of the values. The values are found in the person not in the wrappings.
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Postby ICanCanoeCanU » Mon May 23, 2005 6:39 pm

another clarification for me - everyone in our troop does come to meetings with uniform shirt and we strive for the kneckerchief too but, well you know how that goes. But everyone has the shirt on so for a BOR we already know the scout owns one. We also purchase a few and have them for new scouts and anyone in need. We do not enforce the pants or belt though.

So it's not too much to ask them to wear the uniform for a BOR. We also have several class B (troop t-shirts) for various events and the boys are now designing a new one to purchase polo shirts for the troop. These are usually used on long out of state trips.
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Postby Guneukitschik » Fri Dec 30, 2005 4:33 pm

I think "Scout Spirit" has something to do with wearing the uniform? If the kid is ashamed to go into a store with his Scout uniform shirt on? is that showing Scout Spirit? What if the Scout owns a uniform and NEVER wears it to meetings? I think the least they should do is wear it to the BOR. It's understandable that many scouting activities are not designed for uniform wear...that's where a class-b activity shirt comes in!

I don't think the Scout should be held back from advancing in rank...however I do think the issue should be brought to their attention!
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Postby commish3 » Fri Dec 30, 2005 7:24 pm

While I appreciate that is how you "feel" you have an obligation to follow the requirement as set by the Boy Scouts of America.

The BSA says that what they mean by Scout Spirit is how the scout lives the Oath and Law in his everyday life.

I do not see how you could legitimately deny a Scout his advancement for not wearing his uniform into a store just because you 'feel' that he should.

There are far more important life lessons we are trying to teach the scout through this requirement than whether or not he wears his uniform shirt in public.
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Postby joat » Wed Jan 04, 2006 12:20 am

At the top of this page, someone mentioned the "three obligations of the Scout Oath". What are those 3 obligations?
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