When is enough, enough?

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Postby pipestone1991 » Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:35 am

PaulSWolf wrote:
pipestone1991 wrote:....anyway, I'm taking off my purple religous knot, it's not centered, and I earned a cub scout religous award so I don't think it's right.


No Pipestone, you should keep the knot. It signifies ANY religious award earned as a youth. You should, however, add a small Cub Scout or Webelos Scout "Device" (pin) to the knot to show that it was earned as a Cub or Webelos Scout. Take a look at this page: http://usscouts.org/usscouts/awards/devices.html When you earn a religious award as a Scout, you will then add another pin showing the second award.

If it is the only knot you have, it should be centered.



Yes, I am having it centered........I still can't believe the guy was from 7R....
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Postby Billiken » Fri Jun 08, 2007 10:22 am

pipestone1991 wrote:Yes, I am having it centered........I still can't believe the guy was from 7R....


Not part of staff....some sort of unit leader, there with his troop.

I'll be back for week/session 1 also.

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Postby Chief J » Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:57 am

Hubert wrote:Comming from someone who went to Jambo in '05, I thought you could only wear one patch in that place? And that you can only wear one QU at a time? Once the year is over, its removed. I thought that was the way anyway....Ive been wrong before...lol.


To my knowledge, only interpreter strips and the National Jamboree patch (including activity segments) are worn above the right pocket. Also once you have attended a National Scout Jamboree, that patch can always remain until you attend the next one. Then you should change the patch to the newer National Jamboree patch.

As with quality unit award patches, you wear only the most recent one earned.

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Postby pipestone1991 » Sat Jun 16, 2007 11:45 am

I don't like seeing a leader with a dozen square knots and not one of them Eagle....not even Arrow of Light! I have no clue what most of them are.......
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Scout Law

Postby riverwalk » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:11 pm

Regardless of what knots are worn, you never know the whole story. Some Scouters wear no knots, others just certain knots they qualify for. Following the Law will show respect for everyone, whether they're a knot person, or "not". There are more explanations in real life than what can be gleaned from the one observation.

As far as what they represent (knots), that's fairly simple. My friend with the Knot book, has perhaps the most informative resource for ALL of them AND the devices. I've mentioned it before, but it might not be something we can promote either? There are many sources, some official, and others in Unit websites. Most are inaccurate or incomplete, and often show the "error" knot patches.

Bottom line could be said in this manner: Those of us with knots, NOT including Eagle (because some don't get the opportunity) may be helping many others to get their Eagle. More than that (since few make Eagle) is the help they give to all Scouts. Because Scouting is not about making Eagles, even though we hope they will make it. Scouting is about sharing and teaching the purposes, ideals, and life skills to all we can reach in this Movement.

Now, let's focus on what we'll be doing on August 1st? :wink:
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby Mixedbatch37 » Sun May 23, 2010 4:26 pm

I have been a Scouter for 49 years, and just received the Silver Beaver and in the past two or three years the COmmissioner's Arrowhead, the Distinguished Commissioner Award, the Torch of Gold Award, Commissioner Training Award, Woodbadge Beads, the District Award of Merit plus many other knots earned over the years. Could the Gentleman suggest which one of these I should not wear?. I rather get a giggle about the person who makes fun of the Scouter who looks like a Russian General. Is that envy? I have many patches which I should wear and some that are very important to me. They are precisely positioned on the uniform exactly as they should be. I wear them with pride and I probably do look like the proverbial Russian General. But I wear it all with righteous pride. Just as I wore (and sometimes still wear) my uniform as a US Air Force Colonel, Retired, with three tours of flying combat in Vietnam and a chestful of medals and ribbons to show for it and other service over 27 years. In wearing either uniform, I earned them all. No, I won't be picking and choosing so that I don't look ostentatious. Anything for a patch, right? I find that patch earners are generally the people who also do the work.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby mt_goodrich » Sun May 23, 2010 9:42 pm

I know this continues to be a subject of sore contention among many Scouters.

As for myself, if you wear them correctly and follow the guidelines, then I say wear your knots with pride.

I have heard from several folks that have told me that your knots can serve as your Scouting resume.

One knot that I know gets "trashed" from time to time is the James E. West Fellow knot. I've heard folks say "you shouldn't have to buy a knot".

I look at it differently. I see it as someone who wears the knot as someone who is able to support Scouting financially and has done so. My experience also shows me that this is also a person who contributes a great deal in other areas too.

Does it make someone a bad person as many people like to make them out to be? Absolutely not.

For myself, I received the James E. West Fellow Award in 2007 and I proudly wear that knot, along side my others.
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Re:

Postby ThunderingWind » Mon May 24, 2010 3:27 pm

pipestone1991 wrote:I don't like seeing a leader with a dozen square knots and not one of them Eagle....not even Arrow of Light! I have no clue what most of them are.......

Not all of us had the opportunity to be in Scouting. For me, it was due to the fact that PTA no longer wanted to be the Chartered Organization AND none of the adults shared with us youth (boys) that there was another unit to which we could transfer. We just told that Scouting was no longer available to us.

I serve to see that NO BOY (and young lady) misses the opportunity to experience Scouting just because some adult does not want to do the job anymore.

I respectfully recommend that you reconsider your view on the adults that do not have the Eagle or AOL knot on thier shirt.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby kwildman » Mon May 24, 2010 4:59 pm

Pipestone - I dont like seeing an eagle on a kid that isnt appreciative of having trained leaders or thinks he is above other people. The eagle patch is only a strip of cloth like any of the other patches...the value isnt in the patch but rather the person under the shirt that it is sewn on.

I never made it past the first year and half of cub scouts because the program sucked and YP issues. i got involved to make things better because I wanted to make sure my kids didnt have the same crappy experience that i did.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby ronin718 » Tue May 25, 2010 8:02 am

Before we all start taking shots at pipestone, let's all keep in mind that his last post here was three years ago. At that time he was still a Scout and not familiar with the requirements of life that we adults enjoy. I'm sure he would probably look at that comment now and say "Man, what a noink!!!"

That said, as one who fell well short of Eagle, it is with great pride that I wear my AoL knot, my Webelos Leader knot, and my adult Religious knot. I also get to wear one of the best pins out there... the Eagle Scout Dad pin. It's been a fun ride with my son, and I know that I was a part of it as his Webelos DL and an ASM. This summer we will enjoy the Jamboree together.

That red, white, and blue knot looks really great on an adult, but that was something done as a youth. Those other knots show what the adult is doing to help other youth earn that knot.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby cballman » Tue May 25, 2010 9:56 am

I have read this post from front to back a couple of times since it was posted upon recently. So here is the way that I feel about the knots. If there are people that have rows and rows of knots, I believe that they have earned them in one way or another. So if you earned them then show them off. I dont care if you have 1,2 or 10. If and when I see them on a leader it show me that they either cant say no or they are very interested in our program to complete training and do something for either their Troop or District or Council. Now to look at it another way. If a child needs to earn 21 merit badges for Eagle should we stop at those 21 on his sash and say no more? I DONT THINK SO. So what is the difference between an Adult with knots or a Scout with merit badges. Stop and think about it. Just my little ole humble opinion.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby wagionvigil » Tue May 25, 2010 2:45 pm

I wear a few Knots and I get plenty of questions as to what they are. It helps promote earning some of them. I have two religious awards youth and adult, DAM, Scouters key, Scouters Training Award, COmmissioners Knot, AOL, Silver Beaver, Regional Venturin Leadership Award, and Webelos leader Award. Plus I have a couple I do no WEar.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby razor_strop » Tue May 25, 2010 4:30 pm

wagionvigil wrote:Plus I have a couple I do no WEar.


Would those be the " 'Fraid Knot", the "Knot Anytime Soon" and the "Knot Giving Out Partials"? :mrgreen:
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby FrankJ » Tue May 25, 2010 4:53 pm

I have a knot up side my head. Does that count??
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby RWSmith » Tue May 25, 2010 5:48 pm

razor_strop wrote:Would those be the " 'Fraid Knot", the "Knot Anytime Soon" and the "Knot Giving Out Partials"? :mrgreen:

Let's [k]not forgot the venerable "Knot on a log" and "Knot in my lifetime!". :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby smtroop168 » Tue May 25, 2010 6:58 pm

Knots are awards that if earned they should be worn with pride.

I wish there was a distinction between WOW knots like Silver Buffalo/Antelope/Beaver and the Heroism ones vice Tiger Cub Leader.

Don't get hung up on because someone wears a knot, they know anymore than the guy next to him. Our Pastor removed a scouter from our program because he was unethical. He had 15 knots.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby ThunderingWind » Tue May 25, 2010 8:39 pm

ronin718 wrote:Before we all start taking shots at pipestone,.......snipped/edited......

Typed media takes so much of communications. One missed the tone of voice which help better convey the message.

I did not intend my posting to be taken as "a shot." But I did feel the need to share that are Scouters out there that were
never given a chance to earn the AOL or Eagle and that we give to Scouting because some did NOT give it us as a youth.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby Billiken » Wed May 26, 2010 10:50 am

ThunderingWind wrote:
ronin718 wrote:Before we all start taking shots at pipestone,.......snipped/edited......

Typed media takes so much of communications. One missed the tone of voice which help better convey the message.

I did not intend my posting to be taken as "a shot." But I did feel the need to share that are Scouters out there that were
never given a chance to earn the AOL or Eagle and that we give to Scouting because some did NOT give it us as a youth.


AND his post was from 2007....as a youth.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby ThunderingWind » Wed May 26, 2010 2:59 pm

Billiken wrote:AND his post was from 2007....as a youth.

I missed the jump in the dates of the thread. I read the messages when I noticed a "new" posting.
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Re: When is enough, enough?

Postby kwildman » Wed May 26, 2010 4:40 pm

also guilty of the missed date. Sorry! Old threads ought to go out to pasture at some point. Otherwise we are doomed to keep repeating things like sheath knives, when is active really active, and why doesnt WagionVigil give out partials. :lol:


I wear the webelos knot (four years as a webelos leader i think i earned it), Scouter's Training, Medal of Merit, and just got the DAM.
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