Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

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Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby SN95GT50 » Sat Oct 01, 2011 10:36 pm

I have a Scout that is questioning the meaning of 10 continuous miles.

We did a 9.1 miles hike in the Rocky Mountains and then a few hours later did another hike of about 2 miles. He is questioning whether this would constitute 10 continuous miles.

How about a 5 miles hike out, stopping at a convenience store for 10-15 minutes then returning to complete a 10 miles loop.

So, what is meant by 10 continuous miles?

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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby Reasonable Rascal » Sun Oct 02, 2011 1:19 am

10 miles undertaken on the same day. Yes, rest stops are not only allowed but virtually mandatory. You cannot, however, hike 5 miles, stay overnight and then return another 5 miles and call it 10 continuous miles.

However, regarding an interruption of several hours between segments - as opposed to say stopping for lunch and then continuing - my thought would be that not within the spirit of the requirement. To my way of thinking that would constitute multiple hikes on the same day.

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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby smtroop168 » Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:14 am

Definition of CONTINUOUS
1: marked by uninterrupted extension in space, time, or sequence


"a few hours later did another hike" is not continuous
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby FrankJ » Sun Oct 02, 2011 9:31 pm

It is a judgment call for the MBC based on knowing all the details. But 9.1 is essentially 10. 2 miles later in the same day puts it well over 10. If the scout is constantly looking for the easy way, I would tend be hardline, but if the scout is consistently going beyond the requirements, I would accept it & not think twice.

Look at it another way. If a scout hiked 6.25 miles (50 furlongs) to a beautiful overlook & spent several hours working on the chess merit badge & lunch. Then hiked 6.25 miles back. The miles would certainly be physically continuous. Would accept that for a ten mile hike? What about his slower pal who showed up just after lunch and hiked back with him without a break?
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby Fred Johnson » Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:30 am

Requirements
*Take five hikes, each on a different day, and each of at least ten continuous miles. Prepare a hike plan for each hike.
*Take a hike of 20 continuous miles in one day following a hike plan you have prepared.

I'm confused. The hiking MB requirements state "10 continuous miles". Continuous modifies the distance. IMHO, it's okay as long as you can put a pen to paper and trace 10 continuous miles of hiking without lifting the pen off the paper.

The only time requirement is it be on a single day. Seems like they could take a multi-hour break to do what ever they wanted to do. Maybe they've planned re-supply locations. Maybe they have a big activity on the route such as five hours of fishing. Maybe they even cross the same location one or more times. Maybe they double back on the same route. As long as it's 10 continuous miles, it's okay.

I think the key is NOT a eight mile hike, drive/bike to another location and then another hike of 2 miles. And definitely not splitting between days.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby WeeWillie » Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:45 pm

I would not automatically discount a break when crediting a 10 mile hike. I routinely included activities such as visiting a historic or natural site in conjunction with troop hikes. Many of our areas best sites are off the beaten path and only accessable by trails. Some of those activities were an hour or two depending on the site and Scouts interest.

Was the break included in the hike plan? If it was then it should count. The objective of this requirement is more than just physically walking in the woods (or the desert). Another objective is to teach our Scouts to plan their hikes so that they know what to expect and to expect the unexpected. Be prepared!
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby ThunderingWind » Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:02 pm

FrankJ wrote:...snipped...Look at it another way. If a scout hiked 6.25 miles (50 furlongs) to a beautiful overlook & spent several hours working on the chess merit badge & lunch. Then hiked 6.25 miles back. The miles would certainly be physically continuous. Would accept that for a ten mile hike? What about his slower pal who showed up just after lunch and hiked back with him without a break?


START SARCASM
Both Scouts should be reprimanded for hiking alone (to the site) and be given 10 demerits. The adult leader who let this happen should be sent to a reeducation camp.
END SARCASM
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby AquilaNegra2 » Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:09 am

SN95GT50 wrote:I have a Scout that is questioning the meaning of 10 continuous miles.
We did a 9.1 miles hike in the Rocky Mountains and then a few hours later did another hike of about 2 miles. He is questioning whether this would constitute 10 continuous miles.
How about a 5 miles hike out, stopping at a convenience store for 10-15 minutes then returning to complete a 10 miles loop.
So, what is meant by 10 continuous miles?
John


I would count all of those. Continuous refers to the distance. How long a break is too long? It counts if it's 119 minutes, but not 120? As long as it's the same day, it's good.

However, I would not count a Scout who did 10 miles' worth of a track loop for a walk-a-thon. Nor did I count the Scout who wanted to have his half-marathons count.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby tonkatim » Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:30 am

So, would you give extra credit for the Scout that figured out while preparing his 'hike plan' that the hike would be just short of 10 miles and did not go hiking that day? Also, if that Scout were to argue that he thought that the two hikes were just one hike, would you give him credit? Why let it get to that point.

I realize that I am just a Cubmaster, but we go over all of the requirements before we do them. That way the Cubs that choose not to do them know before hand that they will not receive the award.

I guess that since it has gotten to that point; I would make the Scout explain why he thought the two hikes should count towards the merit badge and if a convincing case were presented, allow it. This is a much more valuable life lesson than just say "no."

Will you ever go on another 9.1 mile hike?
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby AquilaNegra2 » Wed Oct 12, 2011 12:53 pm

tonkatim wrote:So, would you give extra credit for the Scout that figured out while preparing his 'hike plan' that the hike would be just short of 10 miles and did not go hiking that day? Also, if that Scout were to argue that he thought that the two hikes were just one hike, would you give him credit? Why let it get to that point.


I would see it as one hike with a long break. In the same way that a 5.5 mile hike out to a lighthouse, a break for lunch and tour, and 5.5 return is ONE hike. Unless there was a change in location (9.1 miles, a car ride, then 2 more miles), it's the same hike. A planned 10-mile hike where Scouts have to re-route due to an impasse and end up with a 9.1 mile loop can be made in to a 10 mile hike with a few laps around the parking lot. These are supposed to be FUN, and preparing them for their 20.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby tonkatim » Wed Oct 12, 2011 1:26 pm

AN2 -I agree 100 percent. My reply was to the post in general and not to your post.

My point was... at what point was the realization that the hike was not 10 miles and what information was given to the Scouts. Were they given a chance to make it 10 miles and decided not to go the extra .9 mile.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby WeeWillie » Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:45 pm

I think we are getting a bit hyper-legal.

Did the Scout in question make a good faith effort to PLAN a 10 mile hike? There are numerous hiking guides and on line resources to help prepare for a hike. I can see a hike plan being off, but .9 miles is a stretch. Backtrack (no pun intended) the planning process and see how the error occurred.

If I were the MBC I would recommend at the initial meeting the Scout to plan for 11/21 mile hikes so that there always is a margin of error.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby topshot » Sun Nov 20, 2011 10:29 pm

AquilaNegra2 wrote:However, I would not count a Scout who did 10 miles' worth of a track loop for a walk-a-thon. Nor did I count the Scout who wanted to have his half-marathons count.

How does this not meet the requirement for hiking 10 continuous miles? Does it imply it needs to be on a non-durable surface?
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby cballman » Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:23 pm

Looking at the requirements for this badge. I read that you have to make a hike plan for EACH hike. If you plan to hike around a track at a school I would say that is fine BUT, When you build a campfire how can you do it legaly on school property? How can you be properly prepared when on school property you cannot have a knife? If you want to include these types of outings I think they would be fine BUT only 1. period. End of discussion. I personlly would have to say that when doing the Hikeing Merit Badge, I would like to think that if you are going to take the easy way out why not just pay off the merit badge counsulor so that you dont have to do anything. Then we can just forget about the OUTING part of SCOUTING. I THINK NOT. We need to educate young men and their parents that if all you want to do is just the bare minimun then guess what type of scout and leaders we are training. Wow just think if ALL parents and Leaders just did the bare minimun? Holy Cow that would mean that I could have a life other than my 1 hour a week :evil: :evil: Stop and think what would happen if everyone else done the bare minimum at their jobs, Doctors, Nurses, Policemen, Firemen and Emergency Medical Techinans. I would like to apologize for my spelling but I havent had time to remember where my Dictionary is because it is behind all my Scout Books.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby FrankJ » Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:57 am

Where is the campfire required in the hiking merit badge? :? :) Philmont suggest that each crew only carry a couple of knifes. (Advice I suggest you ignore).

I would not call walking around a track a "hike" Maybe a walk-a-thon that went some where.

Somebody doing enough prep to run a half marathon could probably call some of their training runs "hikes".
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby biglou » Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:03 am

cballman wrote:Stop and think what would happen if everyone else done the bare minimum at their jobs, Doctors, Nurses, Policemen, Firemen and Emergency Medical Technicians . .



What is the difference between Doctors, Nurses, Policemen, Firemen and Emergency Medical Technicians that get a "C" and Doctors, Nurses, Policemen, Firemen and Emergency Medical Technicians that get an "A"? NOTHING! They are still Doctors, Nurses, Policemen, Firemen and Emergency Medical Technicians. :lol:

I am sorry but I could not resist that quote because I am a Firefighter and Paramedic. :D :lol:
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby topshot » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:54 pm

What do campfires and knives have to do with this MB? I'd prefer also that they hike in the woods and would encourage them to do so, but don't see how a MBC could not count other activities like half marathons or track walking. Hiking is defined as a long walk especially for pleasure or exercise. I was thinking I'd only except one track hike myself just so the "interesting things you saw" in #7 would be different but nothing says the Scout couldn't do the same forest hike on 5 different days. Yes, that's not following the intent I think but it is meeting the requirements.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby Quailman » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:04 pm

topshot wrote:I was thinking I'd only except one track hike myself just so the "interesting things you saw" in #7 would be different but nothing says the Scout couldn't do the same forest hike on 5 different days.


Interesting things I saw:

My girlfriend was manning a water station at mile 4.

At mile 8 two other runners were doubled over, throwing up.

At mile 7 I think a streaker came by but he was going too fast.

As I approached the finish line a bicycle crossed the path of the guy in front of me making him fall. I helped him back up and assisted him to the finish.


I've hiked extensively in Colorado and Wyoming before I moved to southeastern Texas, with its lack of variation in elevation and dearth of public lands. There's probably much more interesting things to see in a half-marathon than on any of the boring trails around here.
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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby WeeWillie » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:46 pm

Merit Badge Pamphlets are written to provide a guide for teaching and evaluating the subject matter. Hiking MB Panphlet details the skills needed to sucessfully complete the requirements. Does the pamphlet describe walkathons or walking a track? No! Does it describe solo hiking? No!

Just because the requirements HB or MB phamphlet doesn't describe every low ball interpretation of the requirements doesn't mean the MBC can or should wave the magic wand and declare I am a MBC and can sign away any requirement on whim or fancy.

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Re: Hiking MB - 10 Continuous Miles

Postby smtroop168 » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:52 pm

Sometimes I wonder if we ever answered the first poster's question since he/she has vanished from the discussion.

9.1 < 10.0

9.1 + 2.0 < 10.0 +10.0

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