Possible Eagle Required MB

Camping, Citizenship in the Community, Citizenship in the Nation, Citizenship in the World, Communications, Cycling, Emergency Preparedness, Environmental Science, Family Life, First Aid, Hiking, Lifesaving, Personal Fitness, Personal Management, and Swimming.

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Postby ICanCanoeCanU » Wed Jul 18, 2007 9:52 pm

I for one would welcome the old way Waigonvigal and agree with the well roundedness.
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:57 am

Most of the Required Mb are either geared to life skills or lifesaving. Hiking is geard toward excerise and recreation. Swimming on the other hand covers excerise,recreation and lifesaving. You think of Eagle Scouts as the best of the best and in some ways that has gone by the way. AS a Aquatics Counselor any boy that has made First class will also be able to make swimming MB as you have completed a large chunk of the requirements by passing the swimmer test that is unless the SM has blown this requirement off. Which is not uncommon. :(
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Postby Swim4lyfe » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:01 am

I love swimming, but it's just that other Scouts don't and I don't like the thought of them being penalized for not enjoying it. I know it's not difficult, but still... I know a guy who didn't get his Eagle because of that. Many people choose not to be involved with swimming. Why should a Scout in the midwest who is miles away from the nearest pool/stream be required to take a badge that he has no intention of using?
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:03 am

Scouts Enjoy Family Life and Personal Management? No where is it written that a Scout must like the MB they "Must" Take that is why there are Non Required.
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Postby Swim4lyfe » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:07 am

wagionvigil wrote:Scouts Enjoy Family Life and Personal Management? No where is it written that a Scout must like the MB they "Must" Take that is why there are Non Required.

Hey, I liked personal management! :P

What about kids who are afraid of water though? There was a boy at summer camp who was terrified of the water and just barely passed his swim test.

My other point iincludes Scouts who don't use swimming. There are many Scouts who live in the midwest and other regions that are devoid of water suitable for swimming in. Swimming is used a lot in life; if you're near water. If you're not, there's no point. You're not going to use it.
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:09 am

They still must pass the swimmer test to make first class. Swimming MB is not much more work. When it was a required mb with no option I believe there were as many Eagles from the mid west as there is today. 8)
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Postby Swim4lyfe » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:11 am

wagionvigil wrote:They still must pass the swimmer test to make first class. Swimming MB is not much more work. When it was a required mb with no option I believe there were as many Eagles from the mid west as there is today. 8)

Touche. I forgot about that.

Don't get me wrong. I love swimming, but I want to respect the thoughts of other Scouts.
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Postby wagionvigil » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:12 am

Again ,the best of the best.
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Postby Swim4lyfe » Thu Jul 19, 2007 10:14 am

I guess you're right.
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Postby ICanCanoeCanU » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:14 pm

I love swimming, but it's just that other Scouts don't and I don't like the thought of them being penalized for not enjoying it. I know it's not difficult, but still... I know a guy who didn't get his Eagle because of that. Many people choose not to be involved with swimming. Why should a Scout in the midwest who is miles away from the nearest pool/stream be required to take a badge that he has no intention of using?


Hiking or Cycling is the answer then.
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Jul 20, 2007 7:10 am

I personally beieve there should not be any optional Merit Badges that Swimming and Lifesaving should be required to advance to Eagle Unless the scout has a Physical or mental imparement that would not allow it. Johnny is afraid of water is NOT a reason it is an excuse.
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Postby maricopasem » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:38 am

wagionvigil wrote:Johnny is afraid of water is NOT a reason it is an excuse.

I have to disagree. I have two family members (from different sides of the family and completely unconnected) that suffered a traumatic experience (nearly drowned) in the water as young children. Since that time they each have suffered with a psychological barrier to water. It is severe enough that neither of them have even taken a bath or completely immersed their heads in water since those incidents took place.

To paint everyone who has a fear of water with the "Excuse" brush is unfair and inappropriate. Perhaps jumping to conclusions and rushing to judgment are not the best forms of exercise in this case. :)
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:54 am

OK I will agree to a point BUt whom decides if it is or is not? Not the parents that is too easy,not the SM he does not have the authority. there is a committee at the council level that will hold a hearing to review the facts before allowing an alternate requirement. Most will require a medical evaluation by a specialist, not a GP.
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Postby cballman » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:02 am

I just got back from camp and had a young man that had problems in a lake about 3-5 years ago. wouldnt even try to swim but after working with another person this young man overcame his fear and passed his swim test. now a few years ago another young man almost drowned in a ymca swimming class was scared of the water and then a few years ago he earned his swimming and lifesaving merit badges. so IMHO if the child tries to get back into the water then I will work with him but if he wont even look at the water with people trying to help then I would need a evaulation by a trained professional before any changes need to be made. almost sound like the parents are making excuses for the children and not trying to work out the problem.
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:40 am

bingo, charlie bear
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Postby Scouting179 » Fri Jul 20, 2007 1:18 pm

How did those kids who almost drowned make First Class, a waiver?
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Postby wagionvigil » Fri Jul 20, 2007 1:37 pm

excellent question I am interested in knowing that also and if so WHo gave them the waiver? If it was at the local level it is illegal!
These Scouts do take baths or showers do they not? Water is water!
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Postby cballman » Fri Jul 20, 2007 7:58 pm

the way we worked it to start out slowly in shallow water the work out to a little deeper. sometimes it takes quite a while and sometimes the parents dont need to be there because they tell the kids they cant do it. it most of the time is really a mind game with the kids once they see that someone really cares about them and trying to help them most of them will overcome. I think that we as parents sometimes do our kids a disservice by trying to shelter them from reality. sometimes as parents we need to step back and let our kids fail so that they can learn something.
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Postby Lynda J » Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:49 am

My brother was totally terrified of heights. His birth mother threw him off a 15' high landing when he was 4. When my parents and I took him he couldn't even getup on a small step stool to reach the glasses in the cabinet. Standing at the top of the stairs at church made him sick at his stomach. But guess what. With the support of a wonderful SM (understand this was 40 years ago) he managed to earn the Climbing merit badge. It took him nearly 2 years. But of all the badges he earned on his way to Eagle it was the one he was proudest of for his entire life. And until the day I die I will never forget how proud my parents and I were watching him climbto the top then repel down the face of a 100 foot bluff on the Buffalo River. Thought my dad was going to bust out of his briches.
So don't sell kids short. It is so easy to make theexcuse that they are scared. Give them someone that is willing to take the time and expend the energy it takes to work with a kid with this kind of fear and you neverknow where that child can end up.
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Postby Lynda J » Sat Jul 21, 2007 1:56 pm

My bad. I have found out that the Climbing badge didn't come into play until the 90's. I don't remember what badge is was but I remember him climbing and repeling and how long it took him to earn the badge. Some where along the way all him Boy Scout stuff has disappeared. So I can't check. I would have been in the range on 16-17 at the time. He was three years younger. I do remember him coming back down and landing and the look on his face will always be in my mind.

He was never really comfortable with heights but he was no longer terrified of them. He could actually climb a ladder or climb up on top on the hay stacks in the barn.
The point is lets not give kids the easy way out. THey get that at school and at home. Why not push them to be the best they can be. So it takes a little longer to get something done. THen it is worth that much more.
We live in a society of instant gratification. So lets see if we can't teach the boys to slow down and smell the roses.
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